tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915617830446943975.post2479411007497182965..comments2024-03-30T00:33:32.285+13:00Comments on Anglican Down Under: Unscriptural Anglicanism?Peter Carrellhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09535218286799156659noreply@blogger.comBlogger4125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915617830446943975.post-66261007921229573152009-04-28T21:40:00.000+12:002009-04-28T21:40:00.000+12:00We have just had a good time with John Pritchard h...We have just had a good time with John Pritchard here in Nelson. All good and no Holloway!Peter Carrellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09535218286799156659noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915617830446943975.post-52060656314585438092009-04-28T21:00:00.000+12:002009-04-28T21:00:00.000+12:00To express myself more clearly, I think his learni...To express myself more clearly, I think his learning lies in philosophy rather than theology. Yes, he does write for the Church Times, which is the house journal of British liberal catholicism, though whether Fraser's 'catholicism' extends much beyond haberdashery I cannot tell. It's scarcely the liberal catholicism of a Charles Gore, much less a Michael Ramsey.<br />There's a piece on Holloway in the NZ Herald, and it's plain that what I suspected was happening some years ago (that Holloway was abandoning Christian faith - but not before he got his full pension) seems to have come to its bitter fruition. I think he just preceded the Scottish Episcopal Church into oblivion. And yet people like John Pritchard used to quote him with approval, perhaps because he too was 'provocative' - epater les bourgeois etc. It's the easiest thing in the world to be 'provocative' when the target is already hated by the secular liberal establishment. Try 'provocative' criticism of gays and Muslims and see where that gets you today! In prison.<br />The only kind of 'provocation' Christians should give each other, according to Hebrews 10, is toward godly faith and love.<br />Fraser (along with his Southwark colleague Colin Slee) doesn't seem to do much of this kind of provocation.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915617830446943975.post-46870938015299330042009-04-28T19:06:00.000+12:002009-04-28T19:06:00.000+12:00Hi Anonymous,
Well Giles Fraser does provide a lea...Hi Anonymous,<br />Well Giles Fraser does provide a learned Foreword to Andrew Shanks' book, Against Innocence: Gillian Rose's Reception and Gift of faith. Nevertheless I am not averse to criticism of him! You kind of dismiss him, yet he must have some kind of wider influence as he writes regularly for the Church Times!!<br />Thanks for the heads up re Richard Holloway, whom I once heard speak in Durham.<br />I have followed up a little on Eastern Orthodoxy and PSA, via 'The Orthodox Study Bible' which is mysteriously silent about PSA when one looks at the notes on the relevant texts!!Peter Carrellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09535218286799156659noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915617830446943975.post-49674682236291120912009-04-28T18:55:00.000+12:002009-04-28T18:55:00.000+12:00Peter, unlike your good self, I don't find Giles F...Peter, unlike your good self, I don't find Giles Fraser 'very sharp and learned', except to say that his sharpness lies in his tongue rather than his mental acuity. As for his learning, I doubt he has much grasp of the Reformation understanding of grace and the Bible that gave birth to the reformed Church of England. He is by training a student of Nietzsche's philosophy, not Luther's theology. The gaps in his knowledge are not surprising for a parish clergyman, but are embarrassing only because of his relentless self-publicizing. Outside his own circle, nobody takes him seriously. He is a one-schtick pony in a crusade against evangelicals. His liberalism is of a similar stripe to Gene Robinson (whom he has loudly promoted in England) but not (yet) as far down the road as Scotland's answer to Lloyd Geering, Richard Holloway (or 'Hollow way', as I have learned to call him), who will grace your shores next month. (It is a sad thing that people used to take Holloway seriously, including the present Bishop of Oxford.)<br />As for Eastern Orthodoxy, it has never really articulated much of an understanding of the soteriology of the Cross because (a) the Great Schism of 1054 meant that there was very little communication between the East and West, as exactly the time when Anselm was developing his thinking;<br />(b) the focus of soteriology in mystical Orthodox thought lies in theosis, assuming the divine nature (2 Pet. 1.4). Some (maybe many) would critique this in being insufficiently biblical in character, or at least in presentation. Only recently have some Orthodox writers begun to redress this imbalance. <br />If you look in the early pages of 'Pierced For Our Transgressions', you'll find plenty of references to what can only be called penal substitution in numerous early Church Fathers.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com