tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915617830446943975.post6934979879393331208..comments2024-03-28T22:29:52.666+13:00Comments on Anglican Down Under: Faith and Order: supporting the Williams-Kearon linePeter Carrellhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09535218286799156659noreply@blogger.comBlogger4125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915617830446943975.post-10439173683039964972010-06-23T02:19:58.095+12:002010-06-23T02:19:58.095+12:00The only ones who aren't listening are ostrasi...The only ones who aren't listening are ostrasizing, imprisoning and advocating death to people. No need to give the African churches a pass here. Ill take American arrogance on this over African bruatlty. Self-loathing Fr. Bob is just sad.seamusnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915617830446943975.post-45601985927350350362010-06-22T20:02:53.966+12:002010-06-22T20:02:53.966+12:00Where "desperation" meets "normalit...Where "desperation" meets "normality"? That could be crack that lets the light get in ...<br /><br />Disintegration of the Communion? How well is it integrated right now? Some cracking and heaving as the foundations get realigned (not so alarming for those of us in the shaky isles) could lead to a better coming together of the component parts, a better integration rather than the pseudo unity we have accepted to date. More organic maybe, a natural growing together as every tissue makes its own new connections with others in the body - organic that is, rather than imposed from on top? I'm obviously just musing here, but yes one postulate would have to be that Father Rowan might have made some well-intentioned mistakes, although the members of his feuding family will have their own stories his errors.<br />I see a gentle stirring of the Spirit among us all rather than a crisis calling for desperate measures.Howard Pilgrimhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11822571103485207143noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915617830446943975.post-28854961592846295652010-06-22T18:05:38.882+12:002010-06-22T18:05:38.882+12:00Hi Howard,
By 'desperate' I mean 'very...Hi Howard,<br />By 'desperate' I mean 'very keen to continue to belong to the Communion despite being given quite a hard time by other parts of the Communion; and seemingly very keen to remain a member of the Communion despite some voices within TEC suggesting it is time to leave.'<br /><br />As for the situation to be viewed as 'normal'? I cannot go along with you. The Harris-Pilgrim view means that ++Williams has done the wrong thing, misunderstood the majority of the Communion, and mistaken the possibility that the Communion may shortly disintegrate. If the Communion disintegrated, would that be 'normal'?Peter Carrellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09535218286799156659noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915617830446943975.post-85850867058151417802010-06-22T16:07:06.014+12:002010-06-22T16:07:06.014+12:00"It is bizarre that a church desperate to bel..."It is bizarre that a church desperate to belong to the Communion will not listen to the Communion let alone accede to its wishes."<br /><br />Now, where do you get this impression that TEC in general or Mark Harris in particular are "desperate" to belong to the Communion? My reading of Mark's recent blog posts suggests that:-<br />1. He and other TEC advocates are confident that TEC is already a member (indeed the principal founding member) of the Communion.<br />2. Have a clear preference to remain fully accepted rather partially accepted members of the Communion, although not at any cost.<br />3. If forced to chose, will continue to affirm the integrity of their own call to local mission and its gospel imperatives, rather than comply with restrictions placed on them by outsiders, thus placing a higher value on their own unity in mission than on preserving unity with other Communion members.<br />4. Take a long historical view ratifying that priority of provincial over communion commitments, and rejecting arguments that our present situation takes us all "out of normal mode" as you put it.<br /><br />You are the one arguing for a change in ecclesiology, Peter, whatever you think of TEC's changed policy regarding sexuality. I say that we are still very much in normal mode, inasmuch as:-<br />1. Publicly acceptance by some provinces that women are called by God to ordained ministry is simply recognising what has always been the case.<br />2. Publicly acceptance by TEC that people in same-sex relationships have always been among us as Christian disciples and ministers of the gospel is simply recognising what has always been the case.<br />3. Heated differences among Anglicans concerning women's ministries, same-sex relationships, and many other contentious issues have always been a part of our life together, and dealt with with by means of the formal and informal structures that have built the unity in diversity developed over centuries of trial and error. <br /><br />Carry on as usual, that is! Nothing abnormal here.Howard Pilgrimhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11822571103485207143noreply@blogger.com